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07-10-2009, 04:14 PM | Post: #21
FreeLead4All 
(06-10-2009 10:30 PM)Greeves Wrote:  it would be interesting to offer the original skills along with the new skills. Just give people the optoin to choose one or the other. Including the old keg as well as i hear some people loved that compared to the new one. Would give gunners some diverse playing options to fit thier play style.

Don't really know if that would work, but I definitely would be using the old FF. Tried to play with a gunner again today and boy was it frustrating. I'd rather piss broken glass.

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07-10-2009, 10:27 PM | Post: #22
DerMooo 
I once fought a Gunner who used FF, IEG, Hero-shield and Bandages the whole time...
Couldn't bring him down once... maybe that's just because i suck Tongue
but he came out of the most battles with full health... was really annoying Big Grin

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07-10-2009, 11:10 PM | Post: #23
Bernhardt 
Having had lvl 5 FF in my build for a great while before the patch and now after it, I like it how it is now. Previously FF was used for sniping long distance targets with the Long Range MG, but now it's useful with every MG. You can still use it to snipe long distance targets with the Long Range MG, but you can also use it to momentarily turn your Close Range MG into a Medium Range one, for example. The ability is more versatile now.

Also, the healing aspect of the ability is crucial in making it a viable choice in the heat of battle. As you know, you can't use Leg it or Shield while using it, so it needs to pack enough punch for you to survive while you make yourself an easy target. It doesn't just pack enough punch, but it's just what Gunner needs to rule in closer range encounters. I for one know that I've made a bad move if I ever surprise a FF Gunner without having my FF ready for use.

On top of everything, it's fun to use.

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07-10-2009, 11:40 PM | Post: #24
Blackwyn 
I'm quite liking FF on my gunner. Fits in quite nicely with my playing style. I just run into the middle of enemy groups and go berserk with leg it + shotgun on everything, keeping them focused on me. While my team usually supports me from nearby. Then I activate FF with the MG and clean up the rest.

The feeling you get when a group of enemies are all teamed up to go towards you. Then you suddenly activate leg it, rush towards them all and they all take a respectable step backwards to defend themselfs from just one person.. is indescribable.

This is the kind of respect the gunner should always have. He's not a free kill for you. You're all about to become his free kills.

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(This post was last modified: 08-10-2009 09:32 AM by Blackwyn.)
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08-10-2009, 07:12 AM | Post: #25
zotx 
i think ff should add star with 5 damage and go up by 5 per lvl but at lvl 5 it goes up 10.stays at 10 seconds use and 13 seconds re-charge
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08-10-2009, 02:47 PM | Post: #26
FreeLead4All 
(07-10-2009 11:10 PM)Bernhardt Wrote:  Having had lvl 5 FF in my build for a great while before the patch and now after it, I like it how it is now. Previously FF was used for sniping long distance targets with the Long Range MG, but now it's useful with every MG. You can still use it to snipe long distance targets with the Long Range MG, but you can also use it to momentarily turn your Close Range MG into a Medium Range one, for example. The ability is more versatile now.

I can agree with it being more versatile, but I still say it's not as effective. Far from it.

(07-10-2009 11:10 PM)Bernhardt Wrote:  Also, the healing aspect of the ability is crucial in making it a viable choice in the heat of battle. As you know, you can't use Leg it or Shield while using it, so it needs to pack enough punch for you to survive while you make yourself an easy target. It doesn't just pack enough punch, but it's just what Gunner needs to rule in closer range encounters. I for one know that I've made a bad move if I ever surprise a FF Gunner without having my FF ready for use.

As a gunner you have the worst damage per second in the game. That's why it's even more crucial to do as much damage as fast as possible. The old FF was a very big help. Now it takes longer to kill your opponent since you're doing less damage, which means you're worse off than before since your opponent will do more damage per second than you.

(07-10-2009 11:40 PM)Blackwyn Wrote:  I'm quite liking FF on my gunner. Fits in quite nicely with my playing style. I just run into the middle of enemy groups and go berserk with leg it + shotgun on everything, keeping them focused on me. While my team usually supports me from nearby. Then I activate FF with the MG and clean up the rest.

What you just described has nothing to do with how lousy FF is now compared to what it was. If you batter everyone with leg it and shotguns it makes little difference what skill you use after that. You could just as easily use shield at the end instead of FF.

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08-10-2009, 03:25 PM | Post: #27
HATE
There is a slight bonus coming for FF (lvl3-5) whenever PTE goes back up.

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08-10-2009, 03:41 PM | Post: #28
Blackwyn 
(08-10-2009 02:47 PM)FreeLead4All Wrote:  
(07-10-2009 11:40 PM)Blackwyn Wrote:  I'm quite liking FF on my gunner. Fits in quite nicely with my playing style. I just run into the middle of enemy groups and go berserk with leg it + shotgun on everything, keeping them focused on me. While my team usually supports me from nearby. Then I activate FF with the MG and clean up the rest.

What you just described has nothing to do with how lousy FF is now compared to what it was. If you batter everyone with leg it and shotguns it makes little difference what skill you use after that. You could just as easily use shield at the end instead of FF.

FF is a great finisher to use in conjunction with the leg-it + shotgun combo and while shield gets drained in an instant. My health manages to keep up with FF. The FF will only remain effective with the short / moderate ranged MG due to their fast fire rate. But naturally, the most important thing when using FF. Is to be able to hit the target, or it will be crap. I'm also not talking about 1vs1 situations, I'm mainly referring to 1vs3 battles where I take out one with shotgun + leg it then finish off the other two with FF.
I like it, although I see why it wouldn't fit into everyone's playing style, as same as to why everyone doesn't use the leg-it + shotgun combo. But it doesn't mean the ability itself is bad. An ability can only get so good, the rest is up to the player. So to go as far as stating that the ability itself is bad due to personal experiences won't do it any justice. All each have their own playing style and each player will do better with a specific combo than with another combo. We all have our favorites. While some might not be good with the very long distance pistol and prefer an SMG for example. Doesn't mean that the pistol is crap.

EDIT: and what are you scheming this time HATE.. *gives evil eye*

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(This post was last modified: 08-10-2009 03:48 PM by Blackwyn.)
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08-10-2009, 04:03 PM | Post: #29
Patacz 
(06-10-2009 09:58 PM)TheCookieCrusher Wrote:  After the update, if you don't team up with a soldier or something, you're pretty much just meat.

Are you kidding? Now it's pretty much easier to survive solo than before update... This update is just great ! I love to kill people with full health Tongue But gunner still need to be played by skilled players.

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08-10-2009, 04:56 PM | Post: #30
FreeLead4All 
(08-10-2009 03:41 PM)Blackwyn Wrote:  FF is a great finisher to use in conjunction with the leg-it + shotgun combo and while shield gets drained in an instant. My health manages to keep up with FF. The FF will only remain effective with the short / moderate ranged MG due to their fast fire rate. But naturally, the most important thing when using FF. Is to be able to hit the target, or it will be crap. I'm also not talking about 1vs1 situations, I'm mainly referring to 1vs3 battles where I take out one with shotgun + leg it then finish off the other two with FF.

But you're missing one thing: You've not built your gunner around the ability. I have. Your primary combination from the sound of it is leg it and shotty while mine is long range MG and FF. I used that combination with great success for a long time. Before I could do 10-1, or even the occasional 15-1 round. Granted those were rare, but I could do it.

Now I get 4-4 games where at least half my kills are assists. I see no other way to interpret this: FF got a big nerf, or at least its nature was changed to something completely different. Can you honestly say FF gets you any 1 on 1 non-assisted kills?

(08-10-2009 03:41 PM)Blackwyn Wrote:  I like it, although I see why it wouldn't fit into everyone's playing style, as same as to why everyone doesn't use the leg-it + shotgun combo. But it doesn't mean the ability itself is bad. An ability can only get so good, the rest is up to the player. So to go as far as stating that the ability itself is bad due to personal experiences won't do it any justice. All each have their own playing style and each player will do better with a specific combo than with another combo. We all have our favorites. While some might not be good with the very long distance pistol and prefer an SMG for example. Doesn't mean that the pistol is crap.

I can't use leg it but I think it's still a very good ability. Same for keg. I don't find it THAT useful but I can still admit it has its uses. FF on the other hand, I just can't see it being anything more than a way to save a few bandages by shooting occupied enemies if for some reason you survived your last engagement. It doesn't get you kills and it certainly isn't fun.

As it is now, I can't make any use of my gunner as FF + shield + long/medium MG was the only thing I was genuinely good at. Tried everything else but nothing else works for me. You can understand why this bugs me so damn much?

As of yesterday, I've quit playing the gunner class altogether and focused on my soldier. At least that's still fun.

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(This post was last modified: 08-10-2009 05:00 PM by FreeLead4All.)
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08-10-2009, 05:21 PM | Post: #31
Blackwyn 
(08-10-2009 04:56 PM)FreeLead4All Wrote:  But you're missing one thing: You've not built your gunner around the ability. I have. Your primary combination from the sound of it is leg it and shotty while mine is long range MG and FF. I used that combination with great success for a long time. Before I could do 10-1, or even the occasional 15-1 round. Granted those were rare, but I could do it.

Now I get 4-4 games where at least half my kills are assists. I see no other way to interpret this: FF got a big nerf, or at least its nature was changed to something completely different. Can you honestly say FF gets you any 1 on 1 non-assisted kills?

As I said, I'm more of a solo 'go nuts on everyone' kind of player. If there's team mates supporting me from behind, all the better. But usually I'm alone. So yes, as hard as it might be to believe that FF and MG can actually kill people by itself. I do it all the time and I'm sure others do as well.

I did find the old FF personally to be crap. No it was not cause of the damage buff, nor the ability itself in its whole. But the fact that its duration was like 'bang bang' playtime over, good luck. It was too short to actually be useful. Compared to the new FF, I find it a major buff, mainly because of its duration time being longer than before.

My gunner isn't built around leg it + shotgun. I find that along with MG + FF to be my two main combos. The only reason I usually use leg it + shotgun first is to get close to the enemy. Since it's there where MG + FF shines the most, in close combat.

(08-10-2009 04:56 PM)FreeLead4All Wrote:  I can't use leg it but I think it's still a very good ability. Same for keg. I don't find it THAT useful but I can still admit it has its uses. FF on the other hand, I just can't see it being anything more than a way to save a few bandages by shooting occupied enemies if for some reason you survived your last engagement. It doesn't get you kills and it certainly isn't fun.


As it is now, I can't make any use of my gunner as FF + shield + long/medium MG was the only thing I was genuinely good at. Tried everything else but nothing else works for me. You can understand why this bugs me so damn much?

As of yesterday, I've quit playing the gunner class altogether and focused on my soldier. At least that's still fun.

As I said before, the long distance MG + (new) FF is awful, I'll give you that. But that's mainly cause of its fire rate not being fast enough to be able to dish out damage while keeping you healed up and soldiers will easily outdamage your healing and damage.

Each playstyle to his own. If you're having more fun with the Soldier, go for it. After all, having fun with your playstyle of choice is what really matters. If you don't do good with a new ability, you either move on and try to adapt with it to fit in on a new playstyle. Or you change to something else.

It's a shame you're giving up on your gunner so quickly, but I wish you luck with your soldier!

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08-10-2009, 06:18 PM | Post: #32
FreeLead4All 
(08-10-2009 05:21 PM)Blackwyn Wrote:  I did find the old FF personally to be crap. No it was not cause of the damage buff, nor the ability itself in its whole. But the fact that its duration was like 'bang bang' playtime over, good luck. It was too short to actually be useful. Compared to the new FF, I find it a major buff, mainly because of its duration time being longer than before.

FF laster only six seconds but that was usually longer than it took for me to get the kill. If it wasn't enough I'd hit the shield. It would keep me covered until FF was all charged up. Coincidently the shield would also charge up while I was using FF. It worked so well for me.

(08-10-2009 05:21 PM)Blackwyn Wrote:  Each playstyle to his own. If you're having more fun with the Soldier, go for it. After all, having fun with your playstyle of choice is what really matters

Can't say soldiers are more fun what my gunner used to be, but it's about as much fun I can have with this game now.

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(This post was last modified: 08-10-2009 06:20 PM by FreeLead4All.)
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08-10-2009, 11:46 PM | Post: #33
MassiveImpulsa
(06-10-2009 09:45 PM)FreeLead4All Wrote:  
(06-10-2009 09:19 PM)Bauzi Wrote:  @FF:
I can only say that I like this version much more. It suites much more my playing style. For me the fast fire MG was pretty much useless, but it helps a lot now. I really feel like my Gunner is a tank now with Heroshield 5 and FF 3 I can survive quite long. Sometimes I'm really amazed how this ability can help me out on damn hot situations.

That was my initial impression as well. But the more I've used the ability, the more I've become disillusioned by it. To me the best thing about the old FF was how much I could dish out damage with it. Now it's more of a method of healing between fights by shooting a plane etc. I can however see it being an improvement if you like to use the short range MG. I just prefer not to get that close.

EXACTLY SAME WITH ME Confused

I started using the FF at start (Dishing out 14 a KPD the first days! (680kills - 50deathd))


This was mainly because of me teaming upp 24/7...'

Then the snipers started to came along, and i was getting pretty raeaped.

My build is what i'd call Turtle Fortress!

5FF
5HS
3Keg
1IEG

Ripped anything apart close combat, but when it came to moving around, it just didnt work.
Snipers took me down in 2shots, and i couldnt really escape at all >.<

I also noticed that when im in a 2v2, it really hurts burning your FF to hit the HS button, so it usually ended in me killing booth, my teammate died when not using HS.


Blabla what i mean is the Standard Cookie cutter build rocks, and using FF in a 2team situation REALLY isnt suited if playing vs good people, since you most likely should put HS up ASAP or your soldier mate will die pretty quickly..


So summary:

Used FF combo went well, got tired changed to standard leg-it build, and now havent really touched FF since :/
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09-10-2009, 01:32 AM | Post: #34
ElectrifiED 
(08-10-2009 03:25 PM)HATE Wrote:  There is a slight bonus coming for FF (lvl3-5) whenever PTE goes back up.
Another bonus? could that be the extra 2 damage back?
Whatever it is, I just hope it is not something that will make this ability end up as another noob friendly one and make people scream OP.

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09-10-2009, 06:49 AM | Post: #35
FreeLead4All 
(09-10-2009 01:32 AM)ElectrifiED Wrote:  
(08-10-2009 03:25 PM)HATE Wrote:  There is a slight bonus coming for FF (lvl3-5) whenever PTE goes back up.
Another bonus? could that be the extra 2 damage back?
Whatever it is, I just hope it is not something that will make this ability end up as another noob friendly one and make people scream OP.

It's supposedly an increased chance (x5) of scoring a critical hit. I can see it being helpful but I won't get all excited about it until I get to try it out myself. It could very well be that it still wouldn't be as good as +2dmg/shot +crits.

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09-10-2009, 09:04 PM | Post: #36
MassiveImpulsa
5x Increase crit chance, but -3 dmg on all critical hits.
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10-10-2009, 04:05 PM | Post: #37
connorhea 
im a FF gunner and i do agree old +2 was more useful then the heal, what it needs is either add +1 damage plus the heal (+2 and heal would be op) or just increase the heal from 12 to 15-18 range.

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10-10-2009, 06:44 PM | Post: #38
ToiletTrooper 
I don't use FF, that's just not my style. I can heal myself while i'm using bandages. I use instant high damage with 5/5 keg.

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